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#13101601 Mar 02, 2017 at 12:39 PM
Officer
496 Posts
Hey all -

I've been looking with interest at the minstrel healing guides and comparing mini builds to what I've been using on my RK (just for fun). I inspected in-game a minstrel with a morale build and put that into falkennest (I had to estimate on their no-gear base stats, but typed in stats from non-essence pieces including LIs).

It looks to me like that would put a minstrel at about 40% outgoing healing, plus whatever blue-line may give them. Has anyone built this way that can verify that for me?

I am also wondering what a minstrel's HPS typically is, if anyone has healed in T2 or raid situations and looked at combat analysis.

I ask all of this because I am beginning to suspect that either my healing rotation stinks, or RK heals are significantly weaker than those of a minstrel, and I'm trying to get data to evaluate that suspicion. :-)

Thanks for any data y'all can share!

Celordal
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#13102599 Mar 02, 2017 at 09:10 PM
Officer
447 Posts
Cannot reply to specifics nor with actual numbers.

However...

The very first SS T2 (didn't get the challenge - we weren't really worried about it) that we did successfully as a kin (I could be wrong on that point) I was actually on my mini (Blue Line) and healed the group through it. Was horrendously hard for me - wouldn't want to do that again until I have worked on my mini's mits and morale and get her spec'd for T2 content.

My mini is nowhere near T2 content ready and that run took about 4 goes before we got it in the end.

My mini is pretty much how she is now (there may be one or two very minor enhancements, but not material enough to affect any outcomes).

So next time I am on my mini if you need me to do some tests (as long as there aint any alien orrifice testing or probing!!!) then call me up and we can compare notes.
Another one bites the dust...
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#13103016 Mar 03, 2017 at 03:34 AM · Edited over 2 years ago
Knight
189 Posts
I haven't played my minstrel much recently, but I've healed BBS t2c, SS t2c, Rakothas t2c if I remember correctly. I don't usually pay attention to what my HPS is though. Minstrel heals are so big, I can't think of a time when we wiped because my heals weren't enough. It's possible I have selective memory, though ;) Usually if someone dies, it's because they get one-shotted or they're out of range or I'm stunned or something. I run with 45-50k morale, over-capped mitigations, capped crit on healing skills, and zero will/tactical mastery essences. I'll try to look at the numbers next time.

In any case, I think minstrels will generally have higher HPS than RK's because their main healing skill is a big aoe heal as well. Keep in mind, the numbers will be a lot bigger in a 6-person group than a 3-person group, and I think pets get healed too, so they will add to the numbers. RK's rely a lot more on preventing damage, which doesn't show up in HPS as far as I know, but it's often better at keeping a tank alive. A lot of minstrel heals will end up being overheals that don't actually do anything for the group. I don't play my RK very much, but I think as an RK healer, knowing when to use your bubbles/ fates entwined is the most important thing. It may not affect your HPS, but it will keep your group alive. Also, if you have a lot of people standing in the wrong places or not having enough mitigation, any healer is going to struggle, so you shouldn't blame yourself every time your group wipes. I'm not saying that working on a skill rotation and using HPS to help with that is bad, but comparing yours to a minstrel is not apples to apples.
Alifast/Grimbaldin/Alimin/Freabryte/Mohanadan/Bilbaldo/Alirik/Barrysand
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#13103416 Mar 03, 2017 at 07:57 AM
Officer
496 Posts
Thanks for the feedback, both of you! Astey, I'd love to chat about stats if we're both on our healers sometime.

Ali, I've been thinking pretty much the same thing you said, but couldn't find the right words to define it. The last time I was healing Rakothas (T1) I was able to keep my whole group alive until 4 of us got one-shotted so maybe my rotation isn't totally terrible. Always room to evaluate it though. :-)

And you're totally right about some of it being on the other player -- gear and play choices/skill can definitely kill someone. I always feel bad, though, because it's often difficult to know for sure whether I SHOULD have been keeping them alive and failed, or whether there truly wasn't a chance. Except, of course, for Boromir one-shotting a few people! :-D

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#13125446 Mar 13, 2017 at 02:03 AM · Edited over 2 years ago
Valar
241 Posts
I ended up going with a morale build for my mini's blue line.

54.8K morale, 43K Tac Mastery, +10% healing from BB jewelry, with Mits just under 20K each. Crit Rating and Def around recommended values for T2. This is with no buffs included.

Unfortunately, I haven't had combat analysis running while raiding. And of course it does not work when healing Target Dummies as they don't need healing.

So, next time I can get into a raid, I will try to remember to run it and see what Nenro's HPS ballpark is.
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#13127692 Mar 13, 2017 at 11:41 PM
Officer
496 Posts
So does that give you about, what, 65% outgoing healing (counting the jewellery)? Or do you get another buff from blue-line or any of your traits?

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#13137390 Mar 18, 2017 at 12:41 PM · Edited over 2 years ago
Valar
241 Posts
Yes, when Nenro is configured for max morale and max mits, his outgoing healing is 63.7%

I have several duplicate pieces of gear, one with Tac Mast (for dps), and the other with Morale (for healing).

In ToDT yesterday, the troll, I was seeing up to 15K+ HPS when focusing on just healing and when not getting punted. For the mammoths, it dropped to maybe half that or less due to movement.

I am still learning healing tricks, like casting Soliloquy of Spirit just as I am finishing Bolster Courage to cut off the animation so I can immediately recast Bolster Courage.
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#13141111 Mar 20, 2017 at 10:58 AM
Officer
496 Posts
Thanks so much for the feedback Nenro, I really appreciate it!
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#13153136 Mar 26, 2017 at 07:44 AM
Valar
241 Posts
I did some researching on mini HPS. HPS is a bit misleading due to the AOE effects. If you are in an incomplete fellowship, a mini's HPS will be less. If you are in a full fellowship with lots of pets, HPS will be much greater. Plus it can be very situational.

I came across claimed HPS of up to 40K HPS, over double what I was seeing. But most posts agreed that there is lots of overhealing, so as far as I can see, if my group survives, then whatever the HPS is, it is sufficient.

That said, there are two changes for my mini I am considering.
1. Create a new armor piece with 4 Evade essences. Having Evade should decrease the damage I take from adds in ToDT troll fight. I would loose 4 Morale essences if I do so.
2. I need to develop my yellow trait line. From what I have read, yellow is claimed to be pretty good for many fights. What is interesting is that it is not a pure yellow build, but sufficient yellow to get the goodies, then the rest into blue and some red.
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#13154889 Mar 27, 2017 at 04:34 AM
Officer
447 Posts
#13153136 Nenro wrote:

...

1. Create a new armor piece with 4 Evade essences. Having Evade should decrease the damage I take from adds in ToDT troll fight. I would loose 4 Morale essences if I do so.

...



Just to clarify, the evade essences you are considering, is that because you are wanting to achieve a higher miss chance of ranged mobs hitting you? I am uncertain, but I believe at this stage evade is to help reduce the chances of being hit by ranged attacks, parrying is to help reduce the chance of being hit by melee attacks, and blocking, well, I think it means simply blocking any attack. (and when I use the word attack I suppose it is for both physical and/or tactical).
Another one bites the dust...
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#13156821 Mar 27, 2017 at 11:30 PM
Officer
496 Posts
As I understand it, block/parry/evade are all for physical attacks, whether ranged or melee. You can block if you use a shield; parry with your weapon; evade without. If the attacker is behind you, you can only evade; you can do none if you are stunned.

Resistance is (supposedly) for tactical attacks and will work in any direction; I have not checked whether it will work when you are stunned. My combat logs show that practically nothing (of any import) is resisted in silent street so I am assuming it may not be particularly helpful in some of the other Pelennor instances either.

Lotro-wiki on avoidances "Block: Your chance to block or partially block an incoming Melee or Ranged hit. A Shield must be equipped in order to block, and your attacker must be in front of you.

Evade: Your chance to evade or partially evade an incoming Melee or Ranged hit. You can evade a hit from any direction.

Parry: Your chance to parry or partially parry an incoming Melee or Ranged hit. A Weapon must be equipped in order to parry, and your attacker must be in front of you. "

Dadis Guide on avoidances "Block: You must have a shield equipped to be able to block. The attacker must be in front of you to block the attack. Only melee and ranged damage can be blocked, tactical cannot.

Parry: You must have a weapon in your hand to be able to parry. The attacker must be in front of you to parry the attack. Only melee and ranged damage can be parried, tactical cannot.

Evade: You can evade and attack from any direction. Only melee and ranged attacks can be evaded, tactical cannot.

Resistance: You can resist an attack from any direction. Only tactical attacks can be resisted, melee and ranged cannot."
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#13365594 Jul 25, 2017 at 01:06 AM · Edited over 2 years ago
Knight
3 Posts
@nenro

It's quite possible to get some really high parses if the goal is to just do so. Here are some of the numbers when i used to heal rakothas:



However, as you've mentioned, it's all overheals and pointless if group members end up dying anyway. Around 30k hps is plenty enough to keep any group alive in Throne
RK in RK: Chibaku 48

Have 14 toons level capped across servers
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